If there were a way to prevent clients from joining our channel until they have been logged into a server for long enough to have been detected as a Tor, say 5 seconds or so, then my stalker would never gain entry to the channel.

Is this something I can implement on a channel level, or would it have to be implemented at server level?

Is there a cat in hells chance of anyone implementing it?

Something like this would have to be implemented at a server level and probably would be unlikely to be done globally given that since the service needs to check dnsbl's for every client connecting to the network(which at times can be quite a lot) and also some time would need to be allowed for lag between the different servers..while I'm not sure the exact amount of time that would be needed to reliably ensure that clients are checked before being able to join, it would likely be significantly more than 5 seconds and long enough to be annoying to the majority of users who are not on tors or other banned hosts.

As for what you can do about them, there are a few options. First of all, if there is any pattern to the nicks or idents that this person uses, you could try setting bans based on those rather than the ip/host.

Second and probably far more effective, while undernet does not have nick registration, we do have username registrations along with channel mode +r to prevent unregistered users from joining the channel.

You can also try emailing abuse@undernet.org with those logs(preferably with full whois info on this person as well) and see if they may be able to provide additional assistance.

Finally, especially given that this person lives nearby and knows who you are, if they are continually stalking you like this, you might also try contacting their internet servicde provider(if known) or even your local law enforcement agency(particularly if they are making any threats against you or stalking in any ways other than merely joining your channel) and provide the same logs/whois information to them to find out if they can take further action based on that.

The Tor ban policy, while implemented with good intentions, unfortunately falls short of the mark. You ban inactive Tor exit points indefinitely and arbitrarily. I sometimes run a Tor exit node, but I tend to only do so in times of political upheaval around the world when the legitimate load on the Tor network increases. As a result of having been on occasion an exit node, my current IP is apparently banned indefinitely.

It's one thing to make a claim at improving the system, it's another thing to horribly and brutishly implement alleged fixes which actually serve to do nothing but hinder the delivery of services.

Undernet relies on ident, which 99% of the internet using public hasn't got a clue about, and as far as wikipedia is concerned "[...]Ident is next to ineffective when used with personal computers[...]" which is *shocker* most of the internet.

Ban Tor, but rely on hello that hasn't been pertinent since mainframes and dialup? WTF over?

This is a really good example of a reason why it is a very good thing that TORs are banned from the undernet:

I am a long term user (since 1996) and the current manager of an undernet channel with a long history going back to at least 1995. I'm struggling with a stalker who lives nearby, who is known to me and who knows my identity, and who is stalking me on the undernet. This has been going on intermittently for several years and he has now started using tors to evade channel bans. He has previously successfully used this method to evade bans on freenode and has forced the abandonment of a channel there.

While the current pool of regulars in our channel is relatively small, we have an enormous pool of old members going right back to 1995 who drop by from time to time, who we do not want to lock out by setting a key.

Until recently, the tors he used were only very occasionally automatically G-lined by the undernet, but today the system seems to have suddenly become much more effective, detecting about 90% to 95% of my stalker's attempts at entry.

Unfortunately he succeeds in joining the channel before getting G-lined a couple of seconds later. This leads to an ongoing series of joins and G-lines at intervals of a few minutes as well as allowing him access, albeit very briefly, to the channel.

As you might imagine, just as he intends, this is really getting on my nerves and is seriously cheesing off other channel users too. As far as he is concerned, IRC is a public space, and anything he can find a way to do is acceptable behaviour. Not surprisingly, he describes himself as an anarchist too.


One more measure would pretty much eliminate this issue:

If there were a way to prevent clients from joining our channel until they have been logged into a server for long enough to have been detected as a Tor, say 5 seconds or so, then my stalker would never gain entry to the channel.

Is this something I can implement on a channel level, or would it have to be implemented at server level?

Is there a cat in hells chance of anyone implementing it?

You can get an idea of the scale of the problem from how frequently he joins our channel:

[21:55] * nephrodinic has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 212.74.233.43))
[21:57] * awardment has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 68.206.36.124))
[22:03] * overhonesty has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 75.30.97.142))
[22:11] * intercircle has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 128.233.94.137))
[22:16] * ventromyel has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 98.212.204.40))
[22:21] * freckleproof has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 80.79.125.131))
[22:22] * dogal has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 77.41.78.126))
[22:24] * shamefacedly has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 217.211.78.184))
[22:26] * executively has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 213.9.93.174))
[22:27] * reluctant has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. Check http://www.swiftbl.org/lookup for removal. Your IP is 83.227.30.29))
[22:29] * phaeophycean has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 76.5.40.10))
[22:29] * unspiced has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 31.163.103.161))
[22:33] * unwalkable has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 180.149.96.69))
[22:36] * Campodea has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed.
TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 98.113.149.36))
[22:37] * mandibulosus has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 82.183.140.104))
[22:37] * arthrocarcin has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 62.107.252.144))
[22:41] * unweddedly has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 94.50.106.109))
[22:58] * unhooper has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 87.18.45.7))

(channel key set from 22:58 to 00:02)

[00:38] * gastrula has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 173.0.52.171))
[01:03] * rhodizite has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 77.65.144.81))
[01:16] * phthisiogeni has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 83.233.187.231))
[01:27] * thyreoiditis has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 109.107.35.128))
[01:34] * rejecter has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 78.107.237.16))
[01:38] * inconsonantl has quit IRC (G-lined (AUTO [1] DNSBL listed. TORs are forbidden on this network. Your IP is 91.66.3.127))

(channel key set again at 01:38)

Asher,

1, because the people that could do anything about it won't because they have long since decided to block Tor, and do not support it in anyway.

2. because those same people do not read this forum.

As for all the other issues raised in this thread, I have already said my piece, and I support Undernet's decision to block Tor. I will not respond to people that refuse to accept my previous responses, and they have failed dismally to provide better reasons for Undernet to remove the block.

http://it.slashdot.org/story/12/12/09/2315249/tor-network-used-to-command-skynet-botnet

Interesting... seems to me to be another black mark against TOR.

The undernet has not "successfully managed to silence the voice of someone who is suffering under a dictatorship." The management have elected to deny access to clients connecting via TORs to protect the integrity and utility of their own network.

but the undernet does not exist to provide communications for political dissidents

If you (the reader, not any particular poster) are sufficiently concerned about this, you might see fit to set up an alternative IRC network specifically intended for political dissidents and everyone else who you cannot distinguish from them, using TORs to access it. Expect to have problems with trouble makers.

Meanwhile my stalker continues to attempt to break into my channel or to cripple it by taking advantage of TORs and netsplits.

A sad day for freedom